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06-10-2014, 06:18 PM
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#1
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Sheboygan,wi
Posts: 5
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Holding tanks
I am a first time keystone owner. After years of owning forest river and jayco campers we moved up to a larado 300rl fifth wheel. On our first outing with the new rig we discovered that our shower was draining into the black water tank. We have never had that happen before and was wondering is this something normal with keystone?
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06-10-2014, 06:34 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 287
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Are you 100% sure that's the black tank? There have been some recent posts about black / grey tanks that have the colored handles installed backwards.
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06-10-2014, 06:42 PM
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#3
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fraser Valley BC Canada
Posts: 7,015
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What is more "normal" is that the pull handles may have been mislabeled. This happens fairly frequently as reported by many of our members. In your case, the shower may be draining into the gray tank - which is normal and which it should - but the tank has been marked as "black".
Run water down the toilet and open the black tank valve. If nothing comes out when you open the black tank handle/valve then it has probably been labeled incorrectly. Do the same with the sink and shower.
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2008 Cougar 5th Wheel 27RKS
2005 2500 GMC Duramax
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06-10-2014, 06:50 PM
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#4
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Sheboygan,wi
Posts: 5
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I took the unit to the dealer where I bought the unit. They confirmed it does drain to the black tank
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06-11-2014, 04:38 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Central San Joaguin Valley, CA
Posts: 2,117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fireman camper
I took the unit to the dealer where I bought the unit. They confirmed it does drain to the black tank
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It seems you don't believe the dealer, or you wouldn't have asked the forum?
I would urge you to try the trouble shooting technique suggested by Festus2 and then re-label your valves. JMHO - FWIW
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Jack & Marty
2018 Laredo 298 SRL
2011 F-250 SB Crew Cab 4x4 6.7L
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06-11-2014, 06:05 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
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One thing I've learned about the world of RV's is not to be surprised by anything a manufacturer does. It seems that common sense is not a prerequisite for management in this industry.
With that said, I would be all up under that and qualifying their findings. And if they're correct, I'd be all over re plumbing so that the shower was not connected to the sewer. That condition would make for a smelly bath and a lot of dumping.
Sent from my GT-P5210 using Tapatalk
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2015 Ford F350 DRW 6.7 Diesel XL
2020 Avalanche 313 RS
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06-11-2014, 06:19 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: MA
Posts: 3,153
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Sometimes they seem to connect to the closest tank which is just wrong. If the tank ever filled up while in the shower that would be gross to stand in that water. Definately something to have fixed.
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2013 Premier 31BHPR
2014 F350 6.2L
Soon to be just DW and I
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06-11-2014, 07:20 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: 4 Corners ..The land God 4 got
Posts: 203
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Not one of our tanks were labeled. Our new 5er has 2 grey tanks and of course a black tank. 3 handles all the same color and not one of em labeled. Instead of belly ackin to the dealer I made sure all 3 were empty and put 3 gallons in the toilet & went out and pulled handles till I got water. That's was the black tank, emptied it, then put water in the shower, pulled on the other 2 till I got water, that one is shower & it was also bathroom sink and then the 3rd handle had to be kitchen sink..WALL-LA ...I labeled em so now we know which is which. Piece of cake.
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13 F-150 XLT HD Ecoboost
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Life is fantastic & gettin
better every day
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06-11-2014, 07:58 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: WESTERN,CT
Posts: 2,095
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GOT To go with the others.Mine were labled wrong on 2 of the t3 camper i owned. Do the water test. and if the showe is conected to the black tank I would take Keystone to task on that. Check for yourself the dealer maybe telling you fairy tales. Good luck.
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2010 MONTANA 3750FL
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06-11-2014, 11:05 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Illinois
Posts: 581
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Shower drains to Black water tank?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fireman camper
I took the unit to the dealer where I bought the unit. They confirmed it does drain to the black tank
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So, my first question is, did the dealer fix this, or did they just respond; "That's the way your RV was made, so we're good here!"
I would think almost everyone one of us would expect this to be WRONG.
But I'm making or can make an assumption from the limited information in your post. Please provide further follow up..... Choose one of the following options;
o Dealer didn't fix it, just said that's it, so you contacted Keystone for clarification and resolution, or
o Dealer fixed it, so shower drains to Grey water tank.
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Ed & Mary
2017 Cougar 333MKS
2015 RAM 3500 HD with 6.4L
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06-11-2014, 01:59 PM
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#11
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Sheboygan,wi
Posts: 5
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Keystone just responded that that is just the way the camper was made so live with it. Like I said this is a brand new camper and keystone refuses to pay to have it replumbed. Thats why I asked if this is a common thing with keystone.
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06-11-2014, 07:42 PM
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#12
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Sheboygan,wi
Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Javi
One thing I've learned about the world of RV's is not to be surprised by anything a manufacturer does. It seems that common sense is not a prerequisite for management in this industry.
With that said, I would be all up under that and qualifying their findings. And if they're correct, I'd be all over re plumbing so that the shower was not connected to the sewer. That condition would make for a smelly bath and a lot of dumping.
Sent from my GT-P5210 using Tapatalk
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That's exact ally why I am asking if it is common. Keystone says it is built to code two drains per vent and it doesn't matter if the shower is going to black and I have to dump a lot it's to code. I will replumb but I feel keystone should pay for it. Just want to make sure I don't end up with another one
Ike this the next time I buy a new unit
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06-11-2014, 08:49 PM
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#13
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,846
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I still can't get a good handle on the shower being plumbed into the black tank. That's one I've never heard in all my years of multiple holding tanks.
Back when there was only one holding tank per RV (and it was supposed to be the black tank) some customers wanted everything to drain into that tank. Since then, I've never ran across a shower plumbed that way.
Are you sure that the shower and sink aren't plumbed to a tank and it's "mislabeled" as "black tank" ????
As stated by several others, before you go doing any significant replumbing, I'd urge you to go to a dump station, drain all your tanks, close the valves, then run 3 or 4 gallons of water in the bathroom sink, open valves to see which "valve" (not tank name) produces water. Mark that as "GRAY BATH" then close that valve, turn on the shower, run 3 or 4 gallons of water, go back out, open that SAME valve and see if water comes out... I'm seriously guessing that it will.
Then, for "giggles and grins" open the "other valve" (no matter what it's named) and I'm guessing it will produce a smelly discharge..... That's your black tank...
I'm not trying to convince you that "you're wrong" I'm trying to convince myself that you're trailer is plumbed wrong and it's a hard stretch to get onboard that train.....
If you do find what I'm describing to be the way your RV is plumbed, it's correct and your tank valves are all mislabeled.... Yours would be one of literally hundreds to leave Goshen with the labels wrong but the plumbing right..... Just sayin'
Good luck,
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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06-12-2014, 04:10 AM
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#14
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Sheboygan,wi
Posts: 5
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I did do that after our last camping trip and having to dump my black tank 3 times on a 5 day trip (glad we had a sewer site). With both tanks dumped I ran just the shower for about 5 min. And the black tank was the only one to fill so I took the unit to the dealer where I purchased it they tore the underbelly and panels off and found it is indeed draining to black. So on my 5th wheel I have 2 40 gallon holding tanks one for shower and toilet and one for both sinks. Like I said Keystone claims it's to code so they won't do anything. So for future knowledge I want to know if this is normal for keystone. My dealer has never seen this before
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06-12-2014, 05:07 AM
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#15
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,846
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If it is plumbed as you described in the previous post, then NO it is not normal. I've never seen a "main bath" where anything was plumbed to the black tank except the toilet.
In recent years, some manufacturers have started plumbing the washer/dryer to the black tank, but that is an "elective use item" not the shower or sink.
Routinely, the way Keystone plumbs their units is:
TOILET: BLACK TANK 1
SHOWER: GRAY TANK 1
BATH SINK: GRAY TANK 1
KITCHEN: GRAY TANK 2
SECOND BATH SINK: GRAY TANK 2
SECOND TOILET: BLACK TANK 2
In RV's with only two holding tanks, one black and one gray, as with your Laredo and my previous Springdale, with the kitchen and bath in close proximity, all the sinks and shower drain into one gray tank and the toilet is alone, being the only fixture draining into the black tank.
I think I would continue pressuring the dealership/Keystone for a replumbing to the appropriate tank.
Good Luck,
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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06-12-2014, 05:25 AM
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#16
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fireman camper
That's exact ally why I am asking if it is common. Keystone says it is built to code two drains per vent and it doesn't matter if the shower is going to black and I have to dump a lot it's to code. I will replumb but I feel keystone should pay for it. Just want to make sure I don't end up with another one
Ike this the next time I buy a new unit
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Well it's certainly not common and I would be very upset with the situation. However, knowing the rv industry as I do and how it has changed since I worked in it; I would not expect must support from them. I would just spend a weekend replumbing it to suit myself and forget about Keystone.
As to whether you will see the same thing in another trailer; like I said, not common.
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2015 Ford F350 DRW 6.7 Diesel XL
2020 Avalanche 313 RS
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07-07-2014, 07:37 PM
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#17
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Winter Haven, FL
Posts: 16
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Mine were mislabeled, did the add water point A, dump and relabel it. I do have 3 tanks, 1 kitchen, 1 shower & bathroom sink, 1 black.
2014 Laredo 314 RE
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07-14-2014, 04:39 PM
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#18
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Hueytown, Alabama
Posts: 4
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Very odd I thought mine did the same but upon further checking there was another handle that was farther under the trailer. Toilet to black, shower and sink to grey, galley to rear grey tank. Mine is a Springdale 293rkgl 2015 model.
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11-02-2014, 12:58 PM
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#19
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Junior Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Hermiston Oregon
Posts: 6
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I have a 2012 Montana and the tanks were marked backwards. Needless to say this caused a few issues. The fix from the dealer was to put new labeled on. I would suggested empty all tanks, then put green food color in the toilet with some water. Put a little water in the gray tank. Empty each tank one at a time into a 5gal bucket. Which ever one comes out green is the real black tank. Good luck
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11-02-2014, 08:05 PM
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#20
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Fruitland
Posts: 3,357
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If the shower drained into the black tank. Would not the gases from the black tank vent up thru the shower drain if the pee trap gets dry? Just a question if anyone knows if that could or would happen.
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